Peds & giving way at a four-way intersection

netboy
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Peds & giving way at a four-way intersection

Postby netboy » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:23 pm

Hi,

Below is a link to an image of a four-way intersection in a residential area (intersection is Cental Ave/Redholme St, Moorabbin).

https://goo.gl/maps/sX4tkNXKEUk

My understanding of the road rules is that pedestrians crossing any of the four legs have to be given way to by vehicles in Central Ave (i.e. vehicles facing the stop sign), but vehicles in Redholme St only have to give way to pedestrians if the vehicle is turning (but not vehicles going straight).

Is my understanding correct? If it is, I don't believe it's appropriate given the geometry and I'll contact the Council suggesting changes be made to give pedestrians priority at the intersection. If anyone has any ideas on viable treatments that could achieve this it would be appreciated.

TIA.

Day
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Re: Peds & giving way at a four-way intersection

Postby Day » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:31 pm

What isn't appropriate? What happened?

Hardy
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Re: Peds & giving way at a four-way intersection

Postby Hardy » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:35 pm

It is a very standard intersection, and the give way rules don't really need to be explained, do they?
Vehicles in Redholme St only need to give way to pedestrians who are walking along Redholme Street. Pedestrians crossing Redholme St need to give way to cars that come flying around the bend.

netboy
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Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2011 12:24 am

Re: Peds & giving way at a four-way intersection

Postby netboy » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:37 pm

Nothing happened (as far I know) yet; however an increasing number of peds need to cross Redholme when going to/from Moorabbin Station, shops etc.

In my opinion, pedestrians should have right of way there. There is also a blind spot for vehicles travelling north along Redholme (due to the curve).

netboy
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Re: Peds & giving way at a four-way intersection

Postby netboy » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:39 pm

"Flying around the bend" - my point exactly. I would have thought the reason for the question was fairly clear given the geometry. And yes, I did want to clarify the give way rules.

Day
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Re: Peds & giving way at a four-way intersection

Postby Day » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:54 pm

No it wasn't clear, hence the question. I used to drive through there daily and had cause to use it again Thursday and Friday, parking not far from the intersection. What has occured which has caused an increase in pedestrian traffic at that exact point?

What do you want the council to change? Speed signage down to 40, 25 or less? A traffic island at the bend with safety zone for peds? A pedesteian crossing further away from the intersection encoursgjng peds to cross at a safer location? All potential results. It doesnt hurt to ask.

netboy
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Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2011 12:24 am

Re: Peds & giving way at a four-way intersection

Postby netboy » Mon Sep 18, 2017 7:21 pm

Ped traffic is increasing due to the recent development at the TAFE site on South Rd (now also a hospital) as well as recent and upcoming developments to the east. Thanks for the input.

Day
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Re: Peds & giving way at a four-way intersection

Postby Day » Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:36 pm

Good to know. I would put that all in your suggestion.

Gravy
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Re: Peds & giving way at a four-way intersection

Postby Gravy » Tue Sep 19, 2017 2:11 pm

I reckon you're going to struggle to get anything done there, mostly for engineering reasons. The only way I can think of to get vehicles to give way to pedestrians is with a pedestrian (zebra) crossing, but even then siting it that close to both an intersection and a blind bend is likely to cause more problems than it solves. There's no room to fit pedestrian refuge islands anywhere (not that they provide the give way scenario you're after, but they are a pedestrian facility).

The only other thing I can think of is traffic calming measures such as raised platforms, but even that would be a major headache to construct. There are crossovers (driveways) all over the place which makes placing platforms a nightmare. Traditional speed humps are generally hated by locals (mostly because they're really noisy). A slowpoint treatment might work, i.e. chicane using kerb outstands, but this is usually a mid-block treatment rather than something one would install close to an intersection - it makes negotiating the intersection really complicated.

Pin-down speed cushions could be an option. They're not as aggressive as humps and don't require anywhere near the level of engineering of raised platforms or chicanes. They would reduce the speed of vehicles approaching the intersection and could be used on any or all approaches.

Hardy
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Re: Peds & giving way at a four-way intersection

Postby Hardy » Tue Sep 19, 2017 4:58 pm

it is plausible to make Redholme a one way street south-bound from Central Ave.

Which would be a lot cheaper than some alternatives:

[ img ]


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